Tony Campolo Changes His Mind.....

I’ve written about or quoted Tony Campolo in a half dozen blog posts….HERE.

I love Tony Campolo and have followed his ministry...and his wife's ministry....for years. She has always been for the full inclusion of LGBT folks in the church. Tony, well, not so much, although his heart was always kind and tender.

It looks like Tony finally came around. There has been considerable backlash about his statement published on June 8th but he is no stranger to backlash. He has been riling up fellow evangelicals for years. He was even “tried” on heresy charges. In fact, he is the only living evangelical to have endured such a thing. And at the hands of his fellow believers. From Wikipedia:

Campolo was the subject of an informal heresy hearing in 1985 brought about by several assertions in his 1983 book A Reasonable Faith, particularly his claim that, "Jesus is actually present in each other person". The book became a hot button issue, and the controversy caused Campus Crusade for Christ and Youth for Christ to block a planned speaking engagement by Campolo. The Christian Legal Society empowered a "reconciliation panel", led by noted theologian J. I. Packer, to examine the issue and resolve the controversy. The panel examined the book and questioned Campolo. The panel issued a statement saying that although it found Campolo's statements "methodologically naïve and verbally incautious", it did not find them to be heretical.

What pompous asses Christians can be. It seems to me two of the beliefs that mainstream Christians hold nearest and dearest are their beliefs in hell and the depravity of homosexuality. They are also unwilling to take a closer look-see beneath the surface meaning of words in their modern bible translations to see if perhaps they could be mistaken....if the traditional church could be mistaken. That’s how Tony came to a different conclusion.

I was deeply uncertain about what was right.  It has taken countless hours of prayer, study, conversation and emotional turmoil to bring me to the place where I am finally ready to call for the full acceptance of Christian gay couples into the Church.

Another quote from Tony….

However, I am old enough to remember when we in the Church made strong biblical cases for keeping women out of teaching roles in the Church, and when divorced and remarried people often were excluded from fellowship altogether on the basis of scripture. Not long before that, some Christians even made biblical cases supporting slavery. Many of those people were sincere believers, but most of us now agree that they were wrong. I am afraid we are making the same kind of mistake again, which is why I am speaking out.  

Good for you, Tony….

You can read his statement HERE.

And another article that talks about his change of heart and whether this might be the tipping point for evangelicals is HERE.

WWJD Revisited....

On a Christian blog called Formerly Fundie, in a post about the mistaken notion that Christians should try to “take our country back,” the following paragraph stood out.

Instead of just blindly following religious leaders off a cliff, Jesus people should always be asking and wrestling with the questions of, “But what did Jesus say about this? What did Jesus do? What example of Christ have we to follow?”

May I respectfully suggest that this is not rocket science. We can figure it out if we want to. After all, Jesus lived it out in real life situations for us to see. It’s not the knowing that’s hard….it’s the doing that’s sometimes damn near impossible.

There are four gospels all telling the same story (give or take a few minor contradictions). Jesus displays the same behavior, values, compassion, morals, faith, beliefs….sets the same example….throughout all four of the Gospels yet we struggle to figure out how a Christian should behave.

During the recent upheaval in Indiana, John Pavlovitz, a popular blogger, wrote these words that Jesus might say to modern day Christians:

You were designed to do this, to be this.  My kindness, my goodness, my forgiveness; you were created to be the method of transportation for all of it.

My beloved, I placed you here, not to defend or protect or replace me, but simply to reflect me.  That has always been my most critical commandment and your most pressing obligation; loving God and loving others. I thought that I was clear on that, when I was asked this before.

The thing is, he was clear. He was very clear. Could it be that we just don't like what we see....?

Love is a tenet of the Christian Faith

The other day, I listened to a sermon by Adam Hamilton entitled, Love the Sinner, Hate the Sin. He used an illustration about an encounter between Billy Graham and the Clinton’s that took place at a public event during the firestorm of the Monica Lewinsky/”I did not have sex with that woman” debacle….

My father is so accepting, so nonjudgmental," says eldest daughter, Gigi Graham Tchividjian. During the height of the Clinton scandal, she was her father's date at the 75th anniversary celebration for Time magazine. The Clintons were also in attendance.

"Daddy sat with the Clintons and was so warm and gracious," Tchividjian told Charisma. "In the limousine going back to the hotel, Daddy and I were talking about how difficult it must be for the Clintons with so many people gossiping and judging them. His comment was: "It's the Holy Spirit's job to convict; it's God's job to judge; and it's our job to love."

The excerpt above is from a Charisma article

I love that exchange…

I never really paid that much attention to Billy Graham in my BC - before Christ life. Oh sure, my grandmother used to watch his crusades on her little black and white TV when I spent my summers with her. She would cry during his altar calls when folks came forward in droves. I didn't pay much attention to him after I became a Christian. He was getting old. His crusades were fewer and farther between.

A few years ago, I came upon an article on one of those cult watcher blogs about a conversation between Billy Graham and Robert Schuller that smacks of universalism. It resonated so I wrote about it in a post called A Vortex with a Different Name.

I remember other here and there reading about Billy Graham; his reaction to a close call on an airplane (he was very afraid but trusted God with the outcome). And I’ve been reading snippets this morning, my curiosity piqued by this story of his encounter with the Clintons. He had/has his critics. Many criticized his seemingly lukewarm commitment to integration. Others point out that he was either too involved or too UNinvolved with politics. I’ve read some quotes, perhaps taken out of context, that are questionable. Sometimes he seemed to waffle back and forth on some issues.

But the encounter above illustrates a key component of Christianity. As Billy Graham points out, a Christian’s job is to love. You know, the greatest commandment...the command that sums up all the law….love God, love your neighbor as yourself.

Greg Boyd repeats this same sentiment in a video from 2012 during the time a vote on a gay marriage amendment was taking place in Minnesota. Greg Boyd is not one to back away from controversial issues (as he is accused of in the comments) and has taken infinite slack about his opinions and beliefs.

(Probably) More of this rambling, somewhat disjointed discourse to come…..

Picking and Choosing Scripture - Err on the Side of Love.....

At the beginning of the year, in an effort to get my web meanderings in some kind of order, I decided (among other things) to focus on several “preacher-teachers” whose sermons resonate with where I am on my spiritual/human journey. Adam Hamilton was one of them. (also Nadia Bolz-Weber)  I know I’ve mentioned Adam Hamilton numerous times here on this blog.

At the Church of the Resurrection website, there are archives of all his sermons from the present to yesteryear, along with sermon resources etc. At the gym yesterday, I used a version of the “eenie, meenie, miney, moe” method to choose which sermon to listen to. It was entitled “Making Sense of the Bible.” That is also the title of his newest book. He has gotten some slack about it because it takes a good hard “look-see” at what evangelicals hold near and dear; perhaps nearest and dearest….the inerrancy and infallibility of Scripture.

In his opinion, because of the enlightenment and several subsequent movements that have “dissed” scripture, fundamentalists pushed back in a Newtons Law kind of way…...for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. As a result, many evangelical denominations have moved scripture up to the top slot on their faith statements. I googled some well known evangelical churches and found that the Church of God, the Free Methodists and the Baptists all mention scripture FIRST in their faith statements. They mention it before they mention God. They mention it before they mention Jesus. They mention it before they mention the Holy Spirit. I’m sure there are other churches who stick to this hierarchy.

The Bible is not the word of God. Jesus is the Word of God. (In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:1) The Bible CONTAINS the word of God and when we read it, listen to it, pray it and sing it, God speaks to us through it. When we pay attention, God uses the Bible as an instrument of his speaking.

Hamilton suggested using three “buckets”or categories to sort scripture.

The first, and by far the largest, bucket holds the sections of the Bible we read and know beyond a doubt “fit God.” They fit the image of God revealed to us in Jesus. There is no clearer image...no closer representation, no truer benchmark than Jesus. This bucket is easy to fill and the verses contained within console, convict, comfort, caution and clarify. They edify, enlighten and educate. These verses, stories and instructions are timeless. They reveal the heart of the Father that is exactly the same heart Jesus showed us.

The second bucket holds the scriptures that are clearly for another time, culture or situation. Keith had shrimp last night at Red Lobster. Uh-oh….abomination. My blouse was a polyester cotton blend. Uh-oh...abomination. He was sporting a haircut (He does have a beard but he often trims it) A lot of the abominations had to do with cleanliness. There was no Purell water-less hand sanitizer. No antibiotics. No thermometers to make sure food reached a safe temperature to kill bacteria and other nasties. Some of the abominations were to set Israel apart from other nations. Some abominations and OT directives have spiritual implications.

The third bucket is the sticking point for many “God said it, I believe it, That settles it” Christians. It is for scriptures you just don’t know what to do with. Oh, some folks try to explain them away, spiritualize them, justify them. Others ignore them. They are verses that don’t match the character and nature of God revealed in Jesus. They do not match up to any of the Gospel stories….nor to the “summation of the law” that Jesus gave us about loving our God and loving our neighbor. The passages that no how, no way fit the “golden rule” verse in the Bible….

“So whatever you wish that others would do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets. Matthew 7:12.

Genocide, war, violence, stonings, beheadings, trickery. Everyone is familiar with those verses that just don’t make sense.  

Aaaaaaaah….but that is picking and choosing scripture, no? But we all pick and choose. Even those who deny picking and choosing do, in fact, pick and choose. We don’t stone our rebellious teenagers. We don’t stone the folks who commit adultery.  We allow remarried people to worship in our churches. We RE-marry couples in our churches that clearly do not fit the “biblical criteria” for divorce and remarriage. We cut our hair. We don’t cover our heads. Some of us get tattoos. We allow women to speak in church….some churches allow women to preach in church. We eat pork. We don’t banish menstruating women to the shed in the back yard. We all pick and choose.

I like this quote from Carl Gregg's blog

Second, we should not be surprised that everyone engages in “picking and choosing” because if you survey what the Bible has to say about, for example, anger, wealth, adultery, disobedient wives and children, marriage, and divorce it becomes clear that the Bible is simultaneously both contradictory and enormously demanding. In other words, it is essentially impossible to obey all that the Bible literally says because some parts of the Bible are mutually exclusive of other parts. Does this mean that we are free to choose willy-nilly which parts of the Bible to follow? To quote the apostle Paul’s repeated refrain from the epistle to the Romans, “By no means!” However, from the perspective of progressive Christianity, Jack Black as Jesus is right when he says, “If you pick and choose, why not choose love?”

Indeed….why not err on the side of love?

Did He or Didn't He?

Here on Mercy, I’ve written posts based on thoughts and topics piqued by Adam Hamilton. I’ve  thought about/meant to write many more posts based on things I’ve read that he authored (Why?) and sermons that he preached. On the Church of the Resurrection website, where he is senior pastor, there is a vast collection of sermon archives dating back to 1999.

This new year, as part of my goal of getting more structured in my “devotions”, I decided I would listen to sermons (by Adam Hamilton, Nadia Bolz-Weber and Greg Boyd) AND read the Bible (Book of Common Prayer reading plan) while exercising at the gym. Talk about multitasking. So far, so good. Well….so far, pretty good. Not a failure, not a raging success. Still plugging along.

So, I randomly picked a sermon series from last January called Jesus: Myth, Madman or Messiah and listened to the first sermon in the series, “Searching for the Historical Jesus.” I listened to it twice. Learned a thing or two and picked up a different perspective about the historical Jesus. From the sermon notes available on the website:

Let’s begin with an easy question, as there is great consensus even among secular scholars,agnostics and atheists that Jesus actually lived. He was a real, historical person. Dr. Louise Antony, Professor of Philosophy at the University of Massachusetts and a noted atheist stated,“I don't personally know a single atheist who would deny that Jesus existed.” Bart Ehrman, a popular agnostic writer and professor at the University of North Carolina recently wrote a book called, Did Jesus Exist? in which he offers an emphatic yes....

Well, isn’t that cool? And if you want to read a short writing by Bart Ehrman on Huffington Post discussing why he is sure Jesus existed, click HERE.

More from the sermon:

I finished reading Zealot last week. Aslan lays out the premise of the book,

writing: “In the end, there are only two hard historical facts about Jesus of Nazareth upon which we can confidently rely: the first is that Jesus was a Jew who led a popular Jewish movement in Palestine...the second is that Rome crucified him for doing so.”

To watch a 27 minute Huffington post video of Aslan discussing his views about Jesus, click HERE.

Another New Year’s goal...to post more frequently on this blog. In order to do that (and also fit in living my life/exercising/and working at a challenging and full time plus some job) I’ve got to be less picky. This post feels a bit unfinished and unpolished. In the past, I would save it in draft form and plan a series…..which most of the time never actually came to fruition.  

So here it is...as it is. There is fodder for those who might want to read/listen to a bit more. I have intentions to write more about the sermon because it piqued many thoughts and insights. We’ll see if that happens.  For now...I’ve gotta’ get moving and get ready for work.

What is Interfaith?

A weekend or so ago, on our way to the airport for a quick Saturday morning look at the last of the fall foliage...from 4000 feet in the air, Keith and I got into a discussion about the Muslim prayer service held at National Cathedral in Washington, DC. That morning I watched a video of the woman who stood up during the prayer service, disrupting everything, pointing to what must have been a picture of Jesus….declaring him Lord of Lords, King of Kings as she proclaimed the Christian way as the right way...the only way….THE way.

Keith sided with the woman and commended her for standing up for what she truly believed. I sided against the women, pointing out she should not have disrupted the service. He didn't think the prayer service should have been in the church to begin with. I thought it was perfectly fine and an example of what “interfaith” looks like. But the more I think about it, the more I question whether it really was such a good idea to hold a Muslim prayer service in an Episcopal church.

Now I am all into interfaith, inclusion, pluralism. I love the Co-exist picture that shows the symbols for many faiths. I truly believe that there is a TRUTH that is higher and more profound than the truth that is found in separate religions. There are truths in all religions. There are untruths in all religions. But THE TRUTH supersedes every religion.

My own personal “finger pointing at the moon” is Christianity. Sometimes the loud ramblings of some of the far right fundamentalists make me a bit reluctant to voluntarily place myself in the same religious category they claim to belong to. Things like Fred Hamm’s Creation Museum, theocracy and the War on Christmas campaign are just….embarrassing….. to, in any way, associate myself with. But then, Jesus associates himself with the far right fundamentalist Christians so who am I to get all uppity and on my high horse? Besides, I don’t fit in any other category. I truly believe that Jesus was the clearest image of the invisible God. Emmanuel, God with us, name above all names….blessed redeemer…..living word.

I do wonder sometimes if the far right understands the things he said and commanded and proclaimed. Their world view seems so far from the example he set in words, deeds and beliefs. His teachings are pretty clear and straightforward….and just in case we don’t get it the first time when we read the book of Matthew, there are three more gospels that proclaim his sayings and doings. Why the redundancy? So we clearly see HIM from the perspective of four different gospel writers? So we get the point? So we can’t be all wishy washy and unclear on what he said and did...and where he came and went….and the outcasts and sinners he associated with? I think so. Some of his sayings, which are often ignored by so many of his followers are clear cut and unambiguous.

Oh sure, since scripture is like an onion, layer upon layer, there are nuances and depths and meanings hidden beneath (contained within?) the plain meaning. I saw a bumper sticker once that said, “When Jesus said to love your enemies, I’m pretty sure he meant don’t kill them.” Love your enemies. Forgive 7 times 70. Go the extra mile….give them your cape too...don’t murder in your heart or commit adultery in your thoughts, don’t be all judgy or you will be judged. Do I have these things all down pat? Hell, no. I don’t even really like it that he said some of these things that totally go against my instincts. But I don’t deny they are there and “yes, but” and talk around them and make excuses about them or explain them away. I’m a work in progress, I guess….and I am a Christian who is gung ho for the interfaith movement.

So getting back to the subject of this post…lf the local mosque had burned to the ground or was in some way unusable then, yes, it could be considered a gracious, generous move to allow that “congregation” to worship in a local Christian church on a Friday night. But that was not the case and I don’t think it was the brightest or purest idea to hold a Muslim prayer service in an Episcopal church. This was an overkill moment in interfaith, a showy, staged demonstration of pluralism. Except that it wasn't. It was not inclusive but rather exclusive….focusing only on the Muslim faith (a faith I have NO problem with...other than those radical extremists bent on killing the infidel and waging jihad) If the service had been all faiths, worshiping together….a rabbi, a priest, a preacher and an imam leading the service in solidarity and blending the sacred from all of those faith traditions, that is my version of interfaith.

Realizing that we all see through a glass darkly and holding fast to our beliefs while respectfully giving others the same courtesy is interfaith. Focusing on our similarities instead of our differences while raising our voices in praise to the most high God is interfaith. Discussing, mulling, pondering and considering other views...that is interfaith.

A while back I saw pictures of several examples that moved me and demonstrate the true spirit of interfaith. Christians formed a human chain around praying Muslims and Muslims returning the favor by protecting a church during Mass. Links to the original articles and some of the pictures follow….

Here, Here, Here and Here.....

More about the churches-1600 years ago to present

So…the majority of the (very) early churches were universalists. 

The Early Churches:

According to Edward Beecher, a Congregationalist theologian, there were six theology schools in Christendom during its early years - four were Universalist ( Alexandria , Cesarea, Antioch , and Edessa ). One advocated annihilation ( Ephesus ) and one advocated Eternal Hell (the Latin Church of North Africa) The Salvation Conspiracy: How Hell Became Eternal by Dr. Ken R. Vincent

What about now a days. Ahhhh….not so much.  There are, of course, exceptions, but the overwhelming majority buy into the big lie…(ECT) or the smaller lie (Annihilation)

There are some exceptions…but the vast majority of churches do not believe in universalism.  And…the stakes for a belief in UR are usually high. There are some mighty big consequences.

Witness Carlton Pearson’s ousting….and the Rob Bell controversy….and other lesser known folks who were shunned or fired when they came to believe the “heresy” of universalism.  

At one time…for over 90 years…there was a whole denomination…The Christian Universalist Church of America. Their blending into the melting pot of the Unitarian Church was their demise. 

From Wiki:

The Universalist Church of America was a Christian Universalist religious denomination in the United States (plus affiliated churches in other parts of the world). Known from 1866 as the Universalist General Convention, the name was changed to the Universalist Church of America in 1942. In 1961, it consolidated with the American Unitarian Association to form the Unitarian Universalist Association.

There is a fairly new organization called The Christian Universalist Association that has been on the scene five years or so.  There is a lot of info on their website.  There is a list of some churches that openly proclaim a belief in UR on their site…the process for ordination and history/facts/opinions about universalism.  Check them out HERE.

I’ve also been to some universalist churches for conferences…small…Pentecostal feel to them.  Bob Torango’s House of the Lord Fellowship in Dickson, TN…Shalom in Ontario….and others that, while not overwhelmingly Universalist see it as a valid belief option. I’ve been in home bible studies…and met some of the well known universalist preachers/teachers.  Bob Torango….Gary Amariult, Gary Sigler…and other lesser known folks who preach that God will reconcile all of his creation. 

Mainstream denominations?  I find it interesting that the United Methodist Church’s official stand…though not well known…is “dunno.”  On the official website…now relegated to the archives, their official statement is this:

The Confession of Faith of the Evangelical United Brethren Church echoes the beliefs stated in the doctrinal statements of The Methodist Church (see particularly Articles VIII, IX, XI, and XII).

While these statements of doctrine state that salvation is AVAILABLE to all persons, they stop short of saying that salvation is GUARANTEED to all persons. There is the stated or implied condition that, while God's grace is necessary for salvation and that humankind cannot in any way attain salvation without God, that there is certainly an element of awareness and cooperation on our part to order our lives after the image of Christ if we have the capacity to do so.

There are persuasive arguments that include the faithful, thoughtful, and respectful use of Scripture on both sides-- affirming and denying universal salvation. The Book of Discipline, which is the only official printed voice of the UMC, does not make a statement specifically about universal salvation. This places the question in a possible gray area, but the Discipline says what it says. One must read the doctrine there and attempt to understand it as well as possible.

Rev. Dr. Diana Hynson
Director of Learning and Teaching Ministries in the Congregation
General Board of Discipleship

And any UM readers here on this blog are going…nuh-uh.  Does it really say that?  Yes, it does indeed say that.  And it didn’t used to be in the archives.

Another denomination proclaims their belief in the name of their denomination…a (small) group of Primitive Baptists known as the No-Hellers.  Although that is kind of misleading because they do, indeed, believe in a hell.  They think hell is where we find ourselves right now.  In THIS life. Official name -- The Primitive Baptist Universalists.  A down home, no nonsense group of people from Appalachia.

And there were three seminaries that were universalist. 

Crane Theological School in Medford, MA.  1869 to 1968

Theological School of St. Lawrence University in Canton, NY.  1856 to 1965

They Ryder School of Divinity at Lombard College in Galesburg, IL.  1853 to 1930. 

So…while far from the status quo belief of most Christians…to dismiss it with a statement like “almost no major theologians for the past 1600 years” is quite misleading. 

More in my next post about preachers/teachers and authors who, in varying degrees, believe in and teach universalism. 

What we need to apologize for?

Right about the same time I was pondering Thomas Merton’s gracious message to unbelievers, I ran across a blog post about Mark Driscoll’s recent interview with Justin Brierley on a blog called Cognitive Discopants. 
The interview turned into a my church is bigger than your church because there is strong male leadership…namely….”me” (Mark Driscoll)  Your church (Brierley’s) is a wussy church because there are no strong male leaders. Your church is pastored by a….WOMEN….who just happens to be Brierley’s wife.  In fact, according to Driscoll, there really aren’t any strong young leaders in all of England who are preaching the true gospel. 
And the true gospel?  Well, of course the true gospel is a belief in penal substitution and a literal hell with eternal, conscious torment.  Otherwise….you are wishing for a God who is a mom….who embraces everyone. 

Driscoll: Do you believe in a conscious literal eternal torment of hell?
Brierley: What has that got to do with the issue of women in leadership, if you don’t mind me asking?
Driscoll: It does. It depends on your view of God. Is God like a mom who just embraces everyone? Or is he like a father who also protects, and defends, and disciplines? If you won’t answer the question, I think I know the answer.

There is so much offensive in this quote…where do I start?  How about with another quote?  Not from this interview but from a sermon series at his church…Mars Hill.  From Jesus Took Our Wrath (Propitiation)

You have been told that God is a loving, gracious, merciful, kind, compassionate, wonderful, and good sky fairy who runs a day care in the sky and has a bucket of suckers for everyone because we're all good people. That is a lie... God looks down and says 'I hate you, you are my enemy, and I will crush you,' and we say that is deserved, right and just, and then God says 'Because of Jesus I will love you and forgive you.' This is a miracle.

I could (should?) stop here…but here’s another

There is a strong drift toward the hard theological left. Some emergent types [want] to recast Jesus as a limp-wrist hippie in a dress with a lot of product in his hair, who drank decaf and made pithy Zen statements about life while shopping for the perfect pair of shoes. In Revelation, Jesus is a pride fighter with a tattoo down his leg, a sword in his hand and the commitment to make someone bleed. That is a guy I can worship. I cannot worship the hippie, diaper, halo Christ because I cannot worship a guy I can beat up. I fear some are becoming more cultural than Christian, and without a big Jesus who has authority and hates sin as revealed in the Bible, we will have less and less Christians, and more and more confused, spiritually self-righteous blogger critics of Christianity. Mark Driscoll, Relevant Magazine, 2007

The above quote is well known and oft repeated.  While I was  looking for the original source…when and where it actually came out of the “horse’s mouth”….. I came across a post on Justin Scott’s blog that had not only the source of the quote but also an interesting post about being a “chick-ified” Christian man.  Well worth a visit to read the post from last July. I added his blog to my Google Reader feed. 
Yes, indeed…penal substitution….eternal conscious torment…..two of the more heinous doctrines associated with Christianity held up as benchmarks of the faith.
Check out the whole Driscoll /Brierley interview HERE.  And check out Driscoll’s response to some of the backlash HERE.
 

Job Security? Not Unless You Believe in Hell…

Rob Bell recently made a big splash with his book Love Wins.  Firestorm might be a more appropriate way to describe the ensuing reaction. 

He was lambasted by fundamentalists like Justin Taylor in a blog post written before Taylor even read the book.  The post was linked to via Twitter by John Piper….with the sentiments

“Goodbye, Rob Bell.” 

Take note. That is how quickly some Christians will kiss your ass goodbye if you don’t share the beliefs they hold the nearest and dearest. 

People wrote books refuting his book.   Francis Chan’s Erasing Hell, Mark Galli’s God Wins: Heaven, Hell, and Why the Good News Is Better than Love Wins, Is Hell for Real or Does Everyone Go to Heaven written by a group of theologians including J.I. Packer. 

None of the ensuing controversy seemed to affect Bell’s employment status.  Even though he resigned from his church near Grand Rapids, Michigan to move to L.A…..and peddle his wares on a broader scale, it was his own choice.  He wasn’t handed a pink slip for his beliefs.

Others have lost their ministries….their jobs….for questioning the status quo.  

Most everyone knows about Carlton Pearson….former megastar of the charismatic chuch and Azuzu Street fame.  One day while watching a program on TV, God tapped him on the shoulder and changed his entire belief system.  He naively thought that if he simply educated the church folk, they would skip along in lock step belief.  Ah….no. 

He lost a huge chunk of his membership….lost his church and finally ended up in a mainly gay congregation.  Now he is the pastor of a mega new thought church in Chicago. 

Another pastor, Chad Holtz, posted a supportive note on Facebook about Bell’s book and ended up fired over it.  From Marrow’s Chapel…a United Methodist Church no less.  Perhaps his congregation missed the official United Methodist stand on the very question Bell raises in his book….right there on the official United Methodist website for all the world to see…..

There are persuasive arguments that include the faithful, thoughtful, and respectful use of Scripture on both sides-- affirming and denying universal salvation. The Book of Discipline, which is the only official printed voice of the UMC, does not make a statement specifically about universal salvation. This places the question in a possible gray area, but the Discipline says what it says. One must read the doctrine there and attempt to understand it as well as possible.
Rev. Dr. Diana Hynson Director of Learning and Teaching Ministries in the Congregation General Board of Discipleship

And now today, an acquaintance on Facebook, Jackson Baer, posted a video on his wall talking about how he was fired from a church where he ministered for 3 1/2 years as a youth pastor.  How come? Because he refuses to renounce his belief in universal reconciliation.  He has a new book out called “What the Hell”….and he is wondering that exact thing….what the hell just happened?  He loved his church, he loved the people there….and now he is on the outside looking in.  

Christians are loathe to let go of their hellfire and brimstone….and they are quick to kick to the curb anyone who doesn’t share their beliefs about an angry, vengeful God who is more monster than savior…..

Next post, I’ll include links to several other books I’ve come across that discuss the nonexistence of an eternal hell.  It’s a question God settled in my heart a long time ago, shortly after I became a Christian at the ripe old age of 40 something.  Once you see it, you can’t unsee it….and like William Barclay, I Am a Convinced Universalist…..

Christians gone stark, raving mad…

I came upon a story earlier today…on several blogs…outraged at Stephen Bishop, a pastor in Russiaville, Indiana.  Apparently at last week’s children’s sermon, he decided to use some dramatic methods to spark the evangelistic zeal of the church’s youth. 
Quoting the pastor on FB (page..now private and unavailable, but there are some screen shots HERE and HERE and HERE)
“Well, yesterday's sermon was a big hit! We had a mass execution of feeder fish that I pulled out of a fish tank and then threw all over the floor. The kids were in shock and then started to pic[sic] them up and put them back into the fish tank. Obviously, most of them died in the effort...the point however was made that they cared more about .15 cent feeder fish then[sic] they do about their friends dying w/o Christ.”


He defended his methods…and the non-worth of the fish…and gave a lot of lip service to justify his methods.  He also claimed that the elders of the church approved the demonstration.  There is a big, long list of comments (mostly negative) and the original post…about this pastor’s actions on reddit. 
Google it if you want to read more.  Just another example of Christians gone mad in their methods to win the world to Christ.  Geeez.  I’m sure Jesus is so proud…..

The Homosexual Agenda? Is there really such a thing?

Well, I'll be.....it seems I learn new stuff every single time I fire up my computer and venture out into the world wide web...where I continue my ongoing, informal....somewhat haphazard, education....a student at Cyberspace "U."  I love the internet.

And today...at Wikipedia...I learned a new word.  "Homosexualist."  I didn't even know such a word existed.  It was coined by Scott Lively and Kevin Avery.  The following from wiki....

The use of homosexualist in this way first appeared in 1995 in Scott Lively and Kevin Abrams' book The Pink Swastika, "to refer to any person, homosexual or not, who actively promotes homosexuality as morally and socially equivalent to heterosexuality as a basis for social policy."  

These guys even went so far as to blame the horrifics of the Nazi regime on pervasive homosexuality within its ranks. 

Lively and Abrahams in The Pink Swastika argue that alleged homosexuality found in the Nazi Party, specifically within Ernst Rohm's SA, contributed to the extreme militarism of Nazi Germany, and write about the gay agenda in this context.

Oh for goodness sakes.....

How about the total depravity of the egoic mind/carnal nature/adamic man contributing to the extreme militarism of Nazi Germany?  Greed, envy, selfishness, fear, scapegoating, a sacrificial mindset (the sacrifice of others that is), power lust.  

So now homosexuals share at least some of the blame for the Holocaust?  Seriously?

But these guys are but one link in the chain that eventually led to the “outing” of the much feared…much touted homosexual agenda. 

Pretty much the entire populace of right wing America knows about the existence of a gay agenda, but most gays don't have a clue about it.  The vast majority of gay folks are doing what you and I are doing.....leading ordinary, everyday lives.  They are not covertly promoting an agenda.  They are not militant, violent or unruly.  They are more likely to spend a Saturday afternoon at the nearest Borders sipping coffee and leafing through a magazine than dressing up in an outlandish costume and marching in a gay pride parade. 

From a blog post I happened upon in my “studies"

As Oklahoma City teacher Kelly Forbes put it, “We have a gay agenda? I must have missed that meeting.”

So where did the idea come from? 

Well....stir together a little conjecture, mix in a few "scientific studies" with biased and misrepresented outcomes, make propaganda movies to "educate" and warn the unwary in schools and churches.  Take an article written purely as satire and proclaim it to be truth.  Every time the manifesto is read, omit the disclaimer at the beginning clearly identifying it as satire....and repeat it and repeat it and repeat it.....

The history of events that led up to the belief in a homosexual agenda can be found HERE and HERE and HERE if you are interested. 

And the saddest part of this whole thing is that many of these underhanded methods were wrought by Christians.  Followers of Jesus. 

Believing that there is such a thing as a homosexual agenda makes the GLBT community into nameless, faceless enemies.  It is easy to hate folks you don’t see as individuals. (and on a related note, it’s easier to love vast chunks of humanity than it is to love the annoying guy who lives next door.  More on that in an upcoming post)

And in my next post, I’m going to “introduce” you to a couple of guys I “met” on the internet who bought into the gay agenda thing…and spoke out strongly against gay marriage.  One from the pulpit….the other by organizing public rallies backed by a national organization.  But something changed them both.  They started to see gays as individuals….real people. Just like Kathy Baldeck from Canyon Walker Connections…..who I talked about in my post the other day. 

More to follow:

WWJD about GLBT Christians? Figuring it out based on What Jesus Did Do…

I usually try to read when I go to the gym....while hoofing it on the treadmill or pedaling the incumbent bike. I (finally) went to the gym again yesterday.  Emily and I have both been on a several month long hiatus from the gym.  On me, it shows.  On Em...not at all.  We both went back this week...Emily twice...me, well...I made it there once.  I figure her workouts cost me about 25$ each...and mine... 50 bucks.  I have the fees automatically deducted from my checking account...so whether our Nikes hit the treadmill or not, the money still comes out.  But I digress....imagine that!!!

When I went to the gym after work the other day, I took an article I had earmarked to read "when I have more time."  It is one of, literally, thousands of earmarked articles.  A plenitude of articles...not nearly enough time. 

This particular article came from a website I happened upon during our week in Tennessee, while taking a break from church in our motel room…doing what I do best….cruising the internet.  I've earmarked it to explore in more depth...but...a plenitude of websites...not nearly enough time.

It is called "Peace Theology."  The website is authored by Ted Grimsrud, a Mennonite...a denomination known for their anti-violence/peace theology beliefs.  Thus the name.  Peace Theology.  It has a lot of stuff....all written/collected from a non violence perspective.  Very cool. 

The article that caught my eye was under the section about the church and homosexuality.  My own personal view....the church has a sorry ass record when it comes to its treatment of homosexuals.  And this guy thinks so too.  The article is entitled "What Did Jesus Do?" and seeks to outline a christlike pattern of relating to homosexuals based on a variation of the once very popular catch phrase, WWJD...What Would Jesus Do? 

Can we know for sure what Jesus would do (or more importantly what Jesus would have me do) in any given situation? Perhaps not...although this article points out that we can come pretty darn close by taking a look at what Jesus DID DO. 

Jesus was radical.  I'm not so sure we realize how radical he was. On so many occasions, Jesus defied the rules of his "denomination" by healing, interacting with...actually fellowshipping with the untouchables of his day.  And there were a lot of untouchables. 

In our modern day world, we don't have to worry about ceremonial cleansing if we brush up against someone with eczema. Menstruating women are not banished to the garage or the shed out back until they are no longer "unclean."  Thank goodness.  Tax collectors, Roman soldiers, Samaritans.  Oh my God, especially Samaritans.  And Gentiles.  And dead people. But Jesus was not all that concerned with the rules and regulations of his day.  He touched the untouchables. 

Just like the Jews, Christianity also has a long list of untouchables.  The list varies from denomination to denomination...from liberal to conservative....emergent to evangelical...but there is, indeed, a list, sometimes unspoken...but often not.  Sometimes the list of untouchables is a top...top priority to the group.  And for far too many Christians, homosexuality is at the top of that list.  Even liberal, emergent Christians, with a "love the sinner/ hate the sin" mindset, speak out against homosexuality. 

Jesus did not take much time out of his busy schedule to preach about sexual sins.  Homosexual or heterosexual.  He did spare the woman caught in the act of adultery...entrusted the telling of the gospel to the Samaritan woman by the well....let a woman of rumored ill repute wash his feet with her hair.  These things speak volumes and cast the light of understanding on how he might have interacted with homosexuals.  Perhaps we should take our cue from him there too. 

And perhaps we should seriously consider that annoying beam/speck thing he just had to go and say. 

During my "research" of this topic, I came across several very interesting websites. (My research usually amounts to questions that pop into my head while reading/writing about a particular article/book/topic that I then submit to the magic google search engine)  I found several web sites for “coalitions” of gays and straights.  One in particular that intrigued me was a website called Canyon Walker Connections, the website of Kathy Baldeck, who (quoting this from memory) as recently as 2004, did not think she would see any gay folks in heaven.  Although now an impassioned advocate for gays, at one time she was on the other side of the issue…for 20 or so years....until God used (quoting from Kathy's blog)

......a Native American, lesbian, then-agnostic woman to draw me out from my white girl, straight girl, Christian enclave to understand the inequality, the injustice and the church wounding meted out by Jesus followers. Hey, I recognized it;  I was one of them.  It took five more years for me to push open the door fully wide and start to shout to the church. I went to the Gay Christian Network Conference in January 2007 as the first straight supporter, knowing absolutely no one prior to my arrival.  Two months before,  I was  not even sure GLBT believers existed.  Then, to discover that they were organized?!

In a room of 300 GLBT Christians that  first night in worship, I was overwhelmed.  It was then that I put two feet in.  I crossed the line and threw the door to my soul and spirit open wide .  The Holy Spirit was indeed in the midst of His people.  Don’t bother discounting this as an “emotional” experience thus allowing you to justify ignoring my message.  I’ve done this now for five years and the conviction only deepens. Attending the conference immediately brought the end of a five year relationship with a quite homophobic man that I actually wanted to marry.  Purpose or person?  I’ll take purpose for three months of unbearable agony, please.

What a brave woman!!

More tomorrow on some of the other links I ran across...more from the article on Peace Theology....and more on what we can ascertain about what we should DO based on what Jesus DID DO....

Vacation…

Keith and I spent last week in Tennessee.  First part of the week in Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg.  Second part of the week in Lake City…a little town in the vicinity of Knoxville (give or take 50 or so miles) at the yearly conference at Lake City Christian Fellowship…pastors -Justin Philips and his wife Sheryl.  We spent the time with wonderful people…some old friends…some new friends.  We heard 10 of the 11 “official sermons”…and left for home Sunday morning (missed the last service)

As is always the case with me…the sermons were kind of a launch pad for my own thoughts and ponderings.  I don’t always come to the status quo conclusions and most “answers” just inspire “questions” for me.  Below are a few links to webpages of some of the folks we heard speak. 

Lake City Christian Fellowship

Apostolic City Church (Kelvin Mohammed)

Extravagant Grace (Bert White)

Word and Spirit Ministries (David Levister)

New Life MInistries (Kay Fairchild)

 

Same Theory at Work -2

I came across a commentary on the Huffington Post article, The Great Gay Awakening, on a blog I follow called "Losing My Religion." The Huffington article is written by Cathleen Falsani. She starts the article by saying:'

Some of my dearest friends are gay.

Most of my dearest friends are Christians.

And more than a few of my dearest friends are gay Christians

She goes on to say:

As an evangelical, that last part is not something that, traditionally and culturally, I'm supposed to say out loud. For most of my life, I've been taught that it's impossible to be both openly gay and authentically Christian.

And that is the big question...can you be openly gay and authentically Christian?

Even assuming that committed gay relationships are a sin (and I don't believe they are) isn't that akin to asking the question "Can you be openly overweight and authentically Christian?"

The Bible does condemn gluttony after all.

And can you be divorced and remarried for other than purely biblical reasons and authentically Christian? 

You get my point, no?

And that was pretty much the road the author took "back in the early 90's"  Even if it was a sin she felt called to love rather than judge. And she says that loving them was easy…but

 Finding clear theological answers to questions about homosexuality has been decidedly not so.

She quotes Jay Baker (Tammy Faye’s son) a well known evangelical Christian as saying:

Examining the original Greek words translated as "homosexual" and "homosexuality" in three New Testament passages, Bakker (and others) conclude that the original words have been translated inaccurately in modern English.

And how about this little tidbit...which I haven't run across in any of my reading....

The word "homosexual" first appeared in an English-language Bible in 1958.

So since homosexual is not an a word in the original language of the New Testament...but rather a word coined by the translators....what does the original word actually mean?  According to Baker, it refers to

male prostitutes and the men who hire them. The passages address prostitution -- sex as a commodity -- and not same-sex, consensual relationships, he says.

So was it a new revelation in 1958 that caused the Bible guys to coin a new phrase that plummets a whole lot of people to the "abomination" category.   Making up words as we go caused a whole lot of trouble with other concepts like...oh....hell for instance.  

And we all know that the Bible has been used to support all kinds of heinous, bigoted, unfair, ridiculous practices.  And the church...the mainstream evangelical church...has bought it....promoted it,  and enforced it all in the name of “for the Bible tells me so” when in actually the Bible says no such thing....

The church has, at best, lagged behind...and at it's worst, it has actually been the oppressor many times throughout history.  Can anyone really trust the evangelical church to  be their moral beacon?  

Baker says we must "weigh all the evidence." 

And everyone should...prayerfully and with an open mind take another look at the scriptures. And, guys especially, should try to get past what I’ve heard referred to as the "ick factor." The "ick factor" is the emotion that is evoked by a mental image of two guys having sex. Truly, it should not be part of the equation...not is it any of our business. 

One of the commenters at Losing My Religion took issue with the statement about the church always being behind saying that

….there have been some denominations where this isn’t anything new. the UCC ordained a openly gay pastor in 1974. and before the the Unitarians were way out in front. so the church means the Evangelical one.

He also provides a link to a list of other progressive "firsts" for his denomination...

Will there come a day when we look back in a "remember when" kind of way...and think of the time when homosexuals were marginalized and held in disdain?  I think it will happen, but just like there are those who have not caught up to the civil rights movement and still think the white race has a leg up on every other ethnic group, there will be some who will drag their feet. And, like with the civil rights movement it won’t be right….

Colson, Boyd and Claiborne Video

The second video was from a “Speaking of Faith" radio program where three generations of evangelicals…Chuck Colson, Greg Boyd and Shane Claiborne expressed their opinions on a variety of topics.  The snippet I watched was about homosexuality. Greg Boyd said this,

It seems to me that there's two fundamental issues that Evangelicals do have to wrestle with. The one is simply the terrible, abysmal track record the church has towards gays. You know, the reputation out there is that Evangelicals are homophobic and I don't think that it’s liberal media that's spinning that. I think we've earned the right to have gotten that.

But what's happened is, we have a list and our sins, you know, like gossip and greed and gluttony and not caring about the poor, and all the stuff that's mentioned all the time in the Bible, we minimize.

You can be a church member and have that stuff, but the homosexuality issue is all of a sudden the deal-breaker. And who christened that the deal-breaker sin? I don't get that. I used to wonder why did Jesus attract prostitutes and other, you know, sinners that were judged by religion and the church doesn't? They tend to stay away from us as much as the Pharisees. And one of those reasons might be that Jesus never made a public policy trying to pass laws against them. And here's where politics can get in the way of our Gospel message. They don't want to hang out with us, because we made a platform out of, uh, you know, going after them instead of our sins….

Many conservative Christians feel entitled to speak out against homosexuality….and to make it a political issue…a litmus test issue… because of their interpretation of certain verses in scripture that appear, at least on the surface, to deem homosexuality an abomination to the Lord. I think those verses can be explained using the same principles that universalists use to denounce an eternal hell (reasoning, definition of certain words in the original language, context and the customs of the times)   But that is the subject of another series of posts…one that I wrote about, in part, HERE. 

As far as scripture…well, there are plenty of abominable things that touch the lives of all Christians. More than enough abomination to go around…. 

Proverbs 6 comes to mind….

There are six things that the LORD hates,
seven that are an abomination to him:
haughty eyes, a lying tongue,
and hands that shed innocent blood,
a heart that devises wicked plans,
feet that make haste to run to evil,
a false witness who breathes out lies,
and one who sows discord among brothers.  ESV

Note the reference to abomination?  Just sayin'….

 

A Tony Campolo Video

I went “you tubing” yesterday morning. Two of the videos I happened upon are worthy of a blog post….so today video number one.  Tomorrow…video number two.

Video Number One...a snippet from an interview with Tony Campolo answering the question "what would happen if more Christian people, no matter what their theological perspectives, actually got to know the gay people in their neighborhoods" 

Tony replied that for someone who is very “unaccepting” of homosexuality, the turning point often comes when they find out someone they know is gay. A friend, a sibling....a child.  He said the plea of many homosexuals is: 

Would you please get to know us beyond the label. You may find the same Christ that you love, is waiting to be encountered in me.  When you get to know me, perhaps we will feel a spiritual connectedness in a way that transcends the categories.

Then he told a story about a “right before bed” phone call he received...at 10:00 at night… when he was very tired and very ready to call it a day. The caller was a woman he didn't know with a deep theological question.  

Her question....?

Do people get judged immediately after death or does the Lord judge everyone together...at the same time? 

Tony explained his beliefs....and long story short...his answer was that we all get judged together.  Then he said....

Friend, you called me at 10:00 at night.  I don't even know how you got my phone number.  But I have to ask you a question.  Why, at 10:00 at night, would you call up a tired guy like me and ask a heavy question like that?"

She replied,

"well, 3 weeks ago my homosexual son committed suicide...and when he stands before the judgment seat, I want to be next to him and try to tell Jesus what a good and loving boy he was."

That's brought tears to my eyes several times. There is so much pain condensed into that one paragraph.  It contains the pain her son must have endured....until he couldn't endure it anymore and he took his own life.  It conveys the pain she felt at the loss of her son....a son she obviously loved very much.  And most of all, the pain of believing she would have to plead her son’s case to Jesus and talk him into letting her beloved son "into heaven"...that she would have to somehow convince Jesus to forgive him.

And there is a lot of blame condensed into that short snippet.

The church's status quo teaching that homosexuality is the mother of all sins....and that suicide is even one up on that....has brought so much pain and heartache to so many people.  To so many hurting sons and daughters who have assimilated the teachings of the Christian community and translated the message as one of condemnation and rejection. To so many grieving mothers and fathers...mourning the loss of….or the sexual orientation of...their children.

Even more damaging is the church's status quo teaching about judgment...and that Jesus, who was partial to those who were ostracized....society's outcasts....would somehow change into a stern, rigid taskmaster. A judge...quick to condemn and hard to convince, deeming someone worthy of hell for failing to live up the stereotype of a "good Christian." 

Jesus came to seek and save the lost.  He is still seeking and saving the lost.  On both sides of death.  In this earthly realm and in the spiritual realm.

No mother's son will slip through his hands.

I hope that mother has come to believe Jesus already knows what a good and loving boy her son was.  Jesus knows every nuance of the pain and confusion that drove him to take his own life.  And now, without the confines of the flesh...his spirit freed of carnal compulsions....in a realm where there is no male or female or taking in marriage, he will be whole and healed. 

More “tubing” tomorrow….