Tony Campolo Changes His Mind.....

I’ve written about or quoted Tony Campolo in a half dozen blog posts….HERE.

I love Tony Campolo and have followed his ministry...and his wife's ministry....for years. She has always been for the full inclusion of LGBT folks in the church. Tony, well, not so much, although his heart was always kind and tender.

It looks like Tony finally came around. There has been considerable backlash about his statement published on June 8th but he is no stranger to backlash. He has been riling up fellow evangelicals for years. He was even “tried” on heresy charges. In fact, he is the only living evangelical to have endured such a thing. And at the hands of his fellow believers. From Wikipedia:

Campolo was the subject of an informal heresy hearing in 1985 brought about by several assertions in his 1983 book A Reasonable Faith, particularly his claim that, "Jesus is actually present in each other person". The book became a hot button issue, and the controversy caused Campus Crusade for Christ and Youth for Christ to block a planned speaking engagement by Campolo. The Christian Legal Society empowered a "reconciliation panel", led by noted theologian J. I. Packer, to examine the issue and resolve the controversy. The panel examined the book and questioned Campolo. The panel issued a statement saying that although it found Campolo's statements "methodologically naïve and verbally incautious", it did not find them to be heretical.

What pompous asses Christians can be. It seems to me two of the beliefs that mainstream Christians hold nearest and dearest are their beliefs in hell and the depravity of homosexuality. They are also unwilling to take a closer look-see beneath the surface meaning of words in their modern bible translations to see if perhaps they could be mistaken....if the traditional church could be mistaken. That’s how Tony came to a different conclusion.

I was deeply uncertain about what was right.  It has taken countless hours of prayer, study, conversation and emotional turmoil to bring me to the place where I am finally ready to call for the full acceptance of Christian gay couples into the Church.

Another quote from Tony….

However, I am old enough to remember when we in the Church made strong biblical cases for keeping women out of teaching roles in the Church, and when divorced and remarried people often were excluded from fellowship altogether on the basis of scripture. Not long before that, some Christians even made biblical cases supporting slavery. Many of those people were sincere believers, but most of us now agree that they were wrong. I am afraid we are making the same kind of mistake again, which is why I am speaking out.  

Good for you, Tony….

You can read his statement HERE.

And another article that talks about his change of heart and whether this might be the tipping point for evangelicals is HERE.

What Peggy Campolo has to say...

The article I am going to talk about in this post is a transcript of a discussion about homosexuality between Peggy and Tony Campolo from...1996.  Outdated perhaps, but with opinions and sentiments that are hot button issues 13 years later.  I touched on their views in the first post in this series.  As I said, both she and Tony believe that Christians have screwed up the mandate to love our neighbor as ourselves and have openly persecuted homosexuals.  Not all Christians of course...but the Jerry Falwell's, Pat Robertson's, James Dobson's and Fred Phelps' who claim Jesus as their lord yet have fallen short in the "and the greatest of these is love" department. 

And the Campolo's also agree that homosexuality is not a choice but Tony believes that the Bible mandates celibacy.  Peggy does not.  In reference to one of the most oft quoted portions of scripture declaring homosexuality an abomination in the eyes of the Lord, she says the following:

I'd like you to note that Paul wrote Romans in the city of Corinth where the prevailing religion was the worship of Aphrodite. Aphrodite was a hermaphrodite with both male and female sexual organs and in the worship of Aphrodite people played the role of the opposite gender and engaged in sexual orgies with same sex prostitutes who were available in the temple. It was against these orgies that Paul wrote in the first chapter of Romans. There is an obvious connection between idolatry and homosexual practices in Romans one and what Paul says here cannot be applied to the kind of relationships created by loving homosexual partners who are making a lifetime monogamous commitment to each other.

I don't think that that's a proper use of the Bible. Some people, including my husband, say that those who believe as I do about Romans one are stretching the passage to agree with our own a priori beliefs. They say it is arrogant to declare that 19 hundred years of church history and tradition are in error. I would remind these people that all those years of church tradition supported an interpretation of Timothy 2:11 and 12 that disallowed women from church leadership. We only know what the church fathers said because those who might have been the church mothers had no voice.

Later on in this series I will mention a few more scholarly writings that more or less say the same thing, but for this post, I want to quote what Peggy has to say about her time "in the closet."  Even though she was a minister's daughter, until she was 47 years old she faked a relationship with God.  Peggy "met" him at the deathbed of a dear friend of hers.

My husband got in trouble some years ago for saying that Jesus is a presence inside of every person whether or not that person is a Christian. Furthermore, Tony said the place to find Jesus is in loving service to poor and oppressed people. Some in the Christian community argued that Jesus dwelt only in those who believed in him. Right here in Chicago there was actually a heresy trial in 1984 which ended with the jury saying that Tony was not a heretic but did need to be more careful about how he stated things.

But later that same year I learned first hand that Tony was right about where to find Jesus. It happened at the bedside of my dear friend Helen who was dying. Helen had always said she believed in God but now she didn't have any assurance about heaven or peace about dying and there I was, her best friend in this world, not even remotely in touch with God, with Jesus or any hope of heaven. I felt more inadequate than I'd ever felt in my life.

Helen needed God to die and I needed God desperately if I was to be any comfort at all to Helen. So I decided I would tell my friend all that I had ever heard about God and going to heaven. And after all those years in church I knew it well. Helen held my hand for dear life and I know she heard me and as I shared God's grace and love with my dying friend, the presence of God became real to me.

Helen grew too ill to talk after that day but I could talk to her and I did and I believe God did take her home to heaven even as I know God has remained with me. It was in my caring for Helen that I had come to know God. My husband's quest in theology about finding God in those who are in need or being oppressed became a reality to me that day in the hospital. You do stand with God when you stand with and for those who suffer.

She goes on to explain how she came to the realization that God was calling her to stand with and for homosexuals. 

Interesting article...interesting lady.  And for more from both Peggy and Tony, there are four audio messages (two from Tony/two from Peggy) on Gay Christian Network.  I haven't had a chance to listen to them so if anyone has...or does...comments are very welcome here on this blog....

A Tony Campolo Video

I went “you tubing” yesterday morning. Two of the videos I happened upon are worthy of a blog post….so today video number one.  Tomorrow…video number two.

Video Number One...a snippet from an interview with Tony Campolo answering the question "what would happen if more Christian people, no matter what their theological perspectives, actually got to know the gay people in their neighborhoods" 

Tony replied that for someone who is very “unaccepting” of homosexuality, the turning point often comes when they find out someone they know is gay. A friend, a sibling....a child.  He said the plea of many homosexuals is: 

Would you please get to know us beyond the label. You may find the same Christ that you love, is waiting to be encountered in me.  When you get to know me, perhaps we will feel a spiritual connectedness in a way that transcends the categories.

Then he told a story about a “right before bed” phone call he received...at 10:00 at night… when he was very tired and very ready to call it a day. The caller was a woman he didn't know with a deep theological question.  

Her question....?

Do people get judged immediately after death or does the Lord judge everyone together...at the same time? 

Tony explained his beliefs....and long story short...his answer was that we all get judged together.  Then he said....

Friend, you called me at 10:00 at night.  I don't even know how you got my phone number.  But I have to ask you a question.  Why, at 10:00 at night, would you call up a tired guy like me and ask a heavy question like that?"

She replied,

"well, 3 weeks ago my homosexual son committed suicide...and when he stands before the judgment seat, I want to be next to him and try to tell Jesus what a good and loving boy he was."

That's brought tears to my eyes several times. There is so much pain condensed into that one paragraph.  It contains the pain her son must have endured....until he couldn't endure it anymore and he took his own life.  It conveys the pain she felt at the loss of her son....a son she obviously loved very much.  And most of all, the pain of believing she would have to plead her son’s case to Jesus and talk him into letting her beloved son "into heaven"...that she would have to somehow convince Jesus to forgive him.

And there is a lot of blame condensed into that short snippet.

The church's status quo teaching that homosexuality is the mother of all sins....and that suicide is even one up on that....has brought so much pain and heartache to so many people.  To so many hurting sons and daughters who have assimilated the teachings of the Christian community and translated the message as one of condemnation and rejection. To so many grieving mothers and fathers...mourning the loss of….or the sexual orientation of...their children.

Even more damaging is the church's status quo teaching about judgment...and that Jesus, who was partial to those who were ostracized....society's outcasts....would somehow change into a stern, rigid taskmaster. A judge...quick to condemn and hard to convince, deeming someone worthy of hell for failing to live up the stereotype of a "good Christian." 

Jesus came to seek and save the lost.  He is still seeking and saving the lost.  On both sides of death.  In this earthly realm and in the spiritual realm.

No mother's son will slip through his hands.

I hope that mother has come to believe Jesus already knows what a good and loving boy her son was.  Jesus knows every nuance of the pain and confusion that drove him to take his own life.  And now, without the confines of the flesh...his spirit freed of carnal compulsions....in a realm where there is no male or female or taking in marriage, he will be whole and healed. 

More “tubing” tomorrow….

Tony Campolo and Max Lucado on Hell...

This is sort of an afterthought about yesterdays post. I recently posted excerpts from a discussion between Shane Claiborne and Tony Campolo about interfaith dialogue. Within In the course of the discussion Tony said the following...

Catholicism would say that at the moment of death every person is confronted in that split moment with Christ and is given the opportunity of saying yes or no. To say otherwise is to say God has got to be a pretty unfair deity, to condemn three quarters of the human race to hell without them ever having a chance.

Max Lucado says something quite similar in his book Traveling Light

What of those who die with no faith?  My husband never prayed.  My grandpa never worshiped.  My mother never opened a Bible, much less her heart.  What about the one who never believed?

How do we know he didn’t?

Who among us is privy to a person’s final thoughts?  Who among us knows what transpires in those final moments?  Are you sure no prayer was offered?  Eternity can bend the proudest knees.  Could a person stare into the yawning canyon of death without whispering a plea for mercy?  And could our God, who is partial to the humble, resist it?

He couldn’t on Calvary.  The confession of the thief on the cross was both a first and final one.  But Christ heard it.  Christ received it.  Maybe you never heard your loved one confess Christ, but who’s to say Christ didn’t?

We don’t know the thoughts of a dying soul, but we know this. We know our God is a good God. He is “not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.”  2 Peter 3:9 NKJV

He wants your loved one in heaven more than you do. And he usually gets what he wants.

 Grace for the Moment, Volume II Originally excerpted from

Traveling Light

Max is not a universalist…for sure….he makes it very clear in his book 3:16 The Numbers of Hope…but this is pretty close…or as Shane Claiborne says: " If those of us who believe in God do not believe God's grace is big enough to save the whole world... well, we should at least pray that it is.”

It is Shane…it is….

I didn’t know Tony Campolo had a blog….

I happened upon it yesterday as I was wandering around the internet. My launching pad was the google alert I set up for “mercy not sacrifice.”  Every day an email arrives listing when and where the phrase, “mercy not sacrifice” caught google’s attention.  I’ve found several really interesting sites that way.  This time it was Tony Campolo’s blog, Red Letter Christians. 

And so I poked around the site a bit and found several blog posts I paused to read.  Among them….

Whose Death Does God Cheer? ….a post about the killing of Bin Laden.

Hiroshima and the Transfiguration, a Meditation

Why Christians Don’t Like Jesus

Ahhhh….there you go.  The title of that last post mirrors a line in a series I am reading called “What the Bible Really Says.”  The chapter about the Good Samaritan (something I’ve written about here before) closes with this….

The Gospels report that many people who heard the teachings of Jesus became his disciples. But there were many others who heard him and became his enemies.

In today’s world it is sometimes difficult to tell the difference between a disciple and an enemy. Many times those who claim to most reflect his heart and teachings miss the mark spectacularly.  Those called by his name….Christ One’s….seem to have skipped entirely the chapters on love and forgiveness, compassion and generosity, loving your neighbor AND loving your enemy. 

Tony’s focus is emergent, peace promoting, social justice seeking red letter theology.  The God we see revealed in the red letters.

Interfaith Dialogue....at Christmas and All Year Round...

Several things have popped up lately that I think go along with this happy whatever you wanakuh series of posts.  One in my AOL mailbox...and one showed up randomly on a google search while I was looking for something pretty much unrelated.

The first was a link to an article that annie found and posted on EU entitled, Three Clergymen, Three Faiths, One Friendship.  The article is about Rabbi Ted Falcon, the Rev. Don Mackenzie and Sheik Jamal Rahman, the “interfaith amigos.” They travel around the country speaking about interfaith dialogue. They are buds in spite of doctrinal differences. How do they stay friends since religious beliefs are such a hot button topic and oftentimes cause such discord?

Rabbi Falcon told the crowd at the Second Presbyterian Church here. “We try to honor the truth. This is the truth for you, and this is the truth for me. It may not be reconcilable, but it is important to refuse to make the other the enemy.”

During their presentation, each of them tell the audience what they value the most in their own faith tradition. 

The minister said “unconditional love.” The sheik said “compassion.” And the rabbi said “oneness.”

But then, they fess up and reveal what they regard as untruth.

 The minister said that one “untruth” for him was that “Christianity is the only way to God.” The rabbi said for him it was the notion of Jews as “the chosen people.” And the sheik said for him it was the “sword verses” in the Koran, like “kill the unbeliever.”

And about those "kill the infidel verses in the Koran?"

“It is a verse taken out of context,” Sheik Rahman said, pointing out that the previous verse says that God has no love for aggressors. “But we have to acknowledge that ‘kill the unbelievers’ is an awkward verse,’ ” the sheik said as the crowd laughed. “Some verses are literal, some are metaphorical, but the Koran doesn’t say which is which.”

And neither does the Bible, Sheik Rahman.  Many of the religious squabbles among Christians are because every denomination picks and chooses which verses they deem literal and which verses they deem spiritual.  

 

             

 

The other article I came across this morning...and it is not nearly as current.  It is an interview between Shane Claiborne and Tony Campolo about interfaith dialogue.  Tony sums up a very important point.

In a mystical relationship with God, there is a coming together of people where theology is left behind and in this spirituality they found a commonality.

It seems to me that when we listen to the Muslim mystics as they talk about Jesus and their love for Jesus, I must say, it's a lot closer to New Testament Christianity than a lot of the Christians that I hear. In other words if we are looking for common ground, can we find it in mystical spirituality, even if we cannot theologically agree, Can we pray together in such a way that we connect with a God that transcends our theological differences?

So we make sure we don't compromise what we believe. But we also make sure that in mystical spirituality we find a kind of oneness that we leave judgment of who goes to heaven and who goes to hell in the hands of God and just preach the truth as we understand it.

Could it be that the little pet doctrines that we cling to are not all that important to God?  Perhaps there are so many irreconcilable differences even among Christians...(thinking free will/determinism, the various atonement theories, inerrancy of the scriptures)...because God purposed it to be that way?  Perhaps theology (or to borrow an annie term..."theory-ology ") is not what God wants us to focus on. 

And Shane says: 

When it comes to living out the Biblical vision of justice and peace, there are times when I feel like I have more in common with folks of other religions than I do with some other evangelicals. I have often found that while we may not agree theologically, we have a similar vision for how God calls us to live. Can we work together in service and action, even though we disagree theologically?

These two articles sound promising...hopeful but as Tony says:

There is going to be one segment of evangelicalism, just like there is one segment in Islam that is not going to be interested in dialogue.

Hmmmm....Ann Coulter comes to mind.  Jerry Fallwell...Pat Robertson....Fred Phelps...Kirk Cameron...Jack Chick, John Hagee. 

But there are other evangelicals who will want to talk and establish a common commitment to a goodness with Islamic people and Jewish people particularly.

The article contains several stories which tell of actions, heroic and selfless, that crossed religious lines. 

DO SOMETHING!!!

Many times when pondering the POE, we wonder (accusingly) why God doesn't do something to alleviate the suffering in the world.  Feed the starving children, eliminate disease, house the homeless, heal the sick, rejuvenate the dying....wipe out pain and suffering.  After all, scripture does say (three times) he will wipe away every tear.  What...what....pray tell is he waiting for??????

For us?

Didn't he tell us to "take dominion"?  Didn't he give us the task of tending the Garden? 

In an article on beliefnet...written by Tony Campolo (which I have long ago lost the link to) he says of the ponderings and questions shortly after Katrina

Personally, I contend that the best thing for us to do in the aftermath of Katrina is to remain silent, and not try to explain this tragedy. Instead of asking "Why?" we should be asking, "What does God want us to do now?" The loving God calls all believers in the face of Katrina’s devastation to seek ways to express love in concrete ways towards those who have lost friends and family members; and to those who have lost homes along with most of their earthly belongings.

Even in the aftermath of catastrophes both large and small, even when the task seems daunting, we can do something, however small and insignificant it might seem at the time.   

"I am only one, but still I am one. I cannot do everything, but I can still do something. And because I cannot do everything, I will not refuse to do the something I can do." - Edward Everett

"It is the greatest of all mistakes to do nothing because you can only do a little. Do what you can." - Sydney Smith

"How does the Master explain the evil in the world?"
asked a visitor.
One disciple replied, "He doesn't explain it. 
He's too busy doing something about it." - Anthony de Mello, S.J.

So take the first step...stop waiting for God to do it...and YOU do something, however small.

Do not despise these small beginnings for the Lord rejoices to see the work begin.” Zech 4:10 NLT

Some Thoughts On Evangelical, Christian Fundamentalists....

A few months (or so) ago, while surfing around the internet, you know..."researching"...I came upon the Sojourners web site.  It is an emergent, Christian political activist, "love your neighbor as yourself" kind of web site.  Jim Wallis' God Politics blog resides there.  It is a collaborative effort of quite a few emergent, Christian political, "love your neighbor as yourself" activists like Brian McLaren, Shane Claiborne, Bart and Tony Campolo...and others whose names do not ring a bell.  It definitely leans left of center.  I would say that 99.9% of the contributors (and readers) voted for Obama.  Their readership probably does not include the likes of Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin, Ann Coulter, Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggart etc. etc. etc. etc.

While I am not very politically inclined, some of what they write resonates with me.  And because I signed up for email updates, I find Sojo in my AOL mailbox every morning.  I probably would rarely go to the site otherwise.  I have so many interesting, thought provoking, inspiring sites stashed in my bookmarks/favorites... sites that I rarely go to.  So many sites, so little time.  But Sojo shows up in my inbox and so I do sometimes click the link and visit.  I visited this morning.  I checked out their verse of the day, their prayer of the day and scrolled down the list of recent God Politics Blog entries.  This one caught my eye....

God Does Not Heed My Snotty Opinions About Evangelicals

When I read this blog post written by Pastor Nadia Bolz-Weber, I found that I do, indeed, share her snotty opinions about evangelicals. As proof of this, I could probably spout off a dozen or so snotty remarks about all of those people I singled out by name at the end of the first paragraph. And I admit, I do have a problem with some (most?) evangelical, Christian fundamentalists. They seem so cocksure that they not only have God's ear but also a total understanding of His heart.

They remind me so much of the Pharisee in the parable in Luke...the one prefaced with:

To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everybody else, Jesus told this parable

Jesus said:

The Pharisee stood up and prayed about himself: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other men -- robbers, evildoers, adulterers -- or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.

Hmmm...the first thing that seems amiss is that the Pharisee   prayed about himself." A "pat himself on the back" kind of prayer (but that is a topic for a whole other post) He went on to say (obvious paraphrase) "Thank you Lord that my sins are so much less serious and so much less of an abomination in your eyes than the evildoers...like, for instance, that guy over there...that tax collector.

But am I exempt from this self righteous mind set?  I admit that I have a very difficult time not judging those who set themselves up to subjectively judge the actions and beliefs of others based on their own (narrow) interpretation of scripture. Yet am I ...in a way...doing the same thing? Judging my brothers and sisters? Somehow I think there is a distinction, a difference, that I would be hard pressed to explain...a difference that makes my righteous indignation against the Ann Coulter's of the world somehow less offensive than her righteous indignation against....well against just about everything that does not mesh with her mean spirited, right wing world view.  Even Jesus got pissed at the Pharisees!!

Like I said, the distinction is difficult to define or explain...so along with the tax collector in this parable, I will simply have to throw myself on the mercy of the court and proclaim.....God have mercy on me, a sinner.  

I have more to say on this subject....for instance....a few quotes from and comments about the blog post by Nadia Bolz-Weber.  She is quite interesting...with a full sleeve tattoo and a blog site named The Sarcastic Lutheran.  She is also the pastor of the the House For All Sinners and Saints.  I want to post something annie wrote that touches on this left wing/right wing, conservative/liberal, evangelical/progressive feud. 

I am closing this post with a quote from Anne Lamont for all the aforementioned either/or's to ponder:

"You can safely assume you've created God in your own image when it turns out he hates all the same people you do."

More to come...

The Chapter about Homosexuality....

This week in my Sunday School class, a class based on the book by Adam Hamilton, Seeing Gray in a World of Black and White...we are discussing the chapter about homosexuality.  I will be digressing for the next day or so...perhaps longer. 

I spent most of the day yesterday at gay Christian web sites. I have visited some of these sites before since this has long been a topic of interest for me.  I was about forty when I became a Christian and had long lived an almost totally secular lifestyle. I knew gay people...and had known them most of my life. Homosexuality was no big deal to me. 

When I was in my teens, I spent several summers in Wildwood, New Jersey with my (very dysfunctional) family.  My "sort of in the closet" gay uncle...probably in his forties at the time... spent the summer there with us...living in the apartment we all shared. He worked as a doorman at a night club that featured (surprise, surprise)female impersonators.  I got to see the show several times (Diana Ross and Liza Minnelli come to mind) and met some of the guys.  It was not really regarded as a perversion by my family....or by me...and it was openly acknowledged that these guys were gay.  So what?

My grandmother (wild, wild...oh so wild) had a good friend...Warren...who I met a few times and who was openly gay.  I knew what gay was when I was a kid...but I didn't know about the Christian stigma that surrounds it.  Warren did of course and he chose to reject the God who rejected him.  He was a very convinced atheist. 

Later, as an adult, my ex and I had several friends that were gay.  Very gay.  We were invited to their home several times a year and many of the other guests were gay couples.  Again..no big deal.  They were all very nice, professional people. No leather chaps...no chains etc. I didn't really care what their sexual orientation was. 

I worked in restaurants a lot in my younger years when my body could still take the wear and tear of waitressing and I've known a lot of gays throughout the years.  Some were in the closet...some were out.  I remember one guy I took a particular liking to when I lived in Nashville...Wendall.  He was openly gay and I was fine with that.  One day he called me into the back room because he wanted to tell me something.....something that nobody else knew at the restaurant where we worked (Shoney's) "I have AIDS," he said. He had been diagnosed ten years prior.  He was kind of an oddity then since he was still so functional.  This was 13 or 14 years ago and there has been a lot of progress made in the treatment of AIDS. 

  He was involved in what he thought was a long term monogamous relationship.  It was for him...but not so for his partner. His partner was promiscuous, became infected with AIDS and passed it on to Wendall.  He was a kindergarten teacher when he was diagnosed. The doctor told him he had to quit his job immediately or he would infect all the kids....so he quit...and ended up working at Shoney's when he was able.  His main symptom was neuropathy in his legs. 

In spite of his illness, the loss of his career, the heartbreaking betrayal of his partner and the shunning of the Church of Christ (not the liberal United Church of Christ but the ultra conservative southern version of the Church of Christ) he was a happy go lucky kind of guy....a real hoot...hilarious.  He me laugh all the time.  I lost touch with Wendall when I changed jobs and then finally moved away from Nashville.  I wonder about him sometimes though.  I hope he was able to take advantage of some of the new therapies and meds that are available now for AIDS patients. 

I've known other gays through the years.  Even now, I interact with several gay people on a daily basis. I won't belabor the point by retelling the details of every relationship and all of my experiences with gays. From my anecdotal dealings (which have perhaps been more extensive than the interaction most people have with gays...at least knowingly) I see them pretty much as just regular people with a different sexual orientation than mine.  I do not see it as a choice....and in situations where it is truly a lifestyle choice, it is the exception and not the rule.

I know there is homosexual promiscuity...the bath houses...multiple partners...stories of human "chains" but there is promiscuity in heterosexuals too.  And it is my firm belief that if you hear you are a piece of crap enough times, you will act accordingly.  Society, churches...especially churches....have driven home the point that homosexuality is sickening.  Hate the sin, love the sinner.  Even if that was the ideal, how many times is that REALLY put into practice in our churches?  What if the sin is as ingrained as the color of your eyes? 

I've digressed in this digression.  This all sort of started when annie posted an article on EU about a former hate spewing "Christian" who thought homosexuals did not really have the right to breath the same air as he did....whose life changed dramatically one day after he delivered a tirade on the blight of homosexuality at a family gathering.  Afterwards his mom asked the simple question...."do you think your beliefs are Christlike?"

That is a good question, don't you think?  And people on both sides of the issue...people with "black and white" sexual orientations and those with every shade of gray in between should ask themselves that same question.  Do you think your beliefs are Christlike?

I am going to copy and paste the article annie posted below. A couple of other things I found interesting.  Today...Sunday...is the day of a pro-gay rally in Washington.  In my web journeys yesterday I read that the Evangelical Lutheran Church (following the lead of the Anglican church) allows gays in monogamous relationships to be ministers.  And a sort of related interesting note is what I read yesterday about Tony Campolo and his wife Peggy. 

Although they agree on some things related to homosexuals...such as the fact that the LGBT folks need to be assured of equal civil rights, that homosexuality is not really a choice...that the church had done way more harm than good to/for homosexuals...and other similar beliefs, they differ on a very important point.  Tony thinks that homosexuals should practice celibacy.  Peggy believes that monogamous relationships between members of the same sex are a-okay.

I will talk more about that in the next few days. 

A Step in Faith

Evangelical Christian Brent Childers explains his journey from believing that homosexuality was an abomination to marching in a pro-gay march on Washington.

By Brent Childers | Newsweek Web Exclusive

Oct 8, 2009

Lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) Americans are a diverse, extraordinary, resilient, and passionate group of forgiving men and women. I wouldn't be standing beside them demanding full and equal treatment under the law and speaking out against the harm caused by religion-based bigotry at the National Equality March in Washington, D.C., on Oct. 11 if I thought they were not created in God's image the same as myself, same as my family, as we all are—we are all God's children.

And I know better than anyone, since six years ago I was one of those bigots. At that time it would have seemed abominable to even consider attending a "gay-rights" event. To me, these would have been the people tearing apart the very seams of our culture and our country.

Today, it is a natural expression of who I am. Some might call that a miracle.

So what it is that would bring someone from a place where he once declared himself a "Jesse Helms Republican," a man who condemned homosexuality as a threat to children and society, told his own son that being gay is a ticket to hell, to travel from Hickory, N.C., to the West Lawn of the Capitol building on Oct. 11, 2009? How can one travel from the seemingly impossible road of bigotry to one of acceptance and love for our LGBT brothers and sisters? The answer is one that I hope religious leaders such as Pat Robertson and James Dobson (and most importantly, their followers) will hear.

It's because something deep inside told me that I needed to step out in faith onto a bridge of knowledge and understanding. I didn't know where this bridge would take me but something was telling me it was a path I needed to walk. My own mother challenged me in 2003 to look at my beliefs and the true intent behind the teachings I held in blind faith. "Do you think your views are Christ-like?" she asked me. Her question was dead on: once I walked away from the Church's teachings of rejection and condemnation, my relationship with God transcended to a higher spiritual plateau. I realized an unparalleled sense of spiritual clarity when I opened my heart and mind to a genuine expression of love, compassion, and acceptance of all sexual orientations and gender identities.

This new voice—Christ's voice—became the core principles of my faith: love, compassion, and respect. That voice I now realize was desperately wanting to be heard, a voice no longer comfortable with the place in which I had chose to confine it for so long—a place of bigotry, prejudice, fear, and misunderstanding.

The walk across that bridge wasn't very strenuous but it was at times painful. The pain came as I began to realize for the first time that I had been using my faith to bring harm to others. That's not a pleasant realization for anyone who marches under a Christian banner of love, respect, and compassion.

During the past four years I have looked into the faces of those I once caused harm to with religion-based bigotry and prejudice. And while I may have never inflicted a physical blow, I know today that my words indeed caused deep wounds—perhaps at some point deeper than I care to dwell upon.

They are the faces of individuals like young Sean Kennedy, who died in Greenville, S.C., in 2007 after being struck by a person who considered Sean a "faggot"; Pat and Lynn Mulder of Auburndale, Fla., whose gay son also died as a result of a hate crime; Jared Horsford of Texas who carved derogatory words into his flesh because he thought it would help control the demon he was told lived there; Nicholas White who was relentlessly berated by fellow 4-H peers at camp this summer as other 4-H campers stood behind the tormentors in silence; or the mother I met recently in North Carolina who grieved over her dead son—a child that had been rejected because he was gay and thought peace could only come through suicide.

There are many, many others I have met in my work with Faith in America, as we try to bring awareness and understanding to the pain and trauma caused to LGBT people, especially youth, when church teaching is misused to justify and promote a societal climate of rejection, condemnation, and discrimination. This environment fosters suicide, hate crimes, an epidemic of antigay bullying in our schools against all kinds of children gay and straight, legal workplace discrimination against LGBT citizens in 20 states, military service members forced to serve in silence or discharged for being honest about who they are, lesbian and gay parents unable to protect their children without the legal structure of federally recognized civil marriage, and lesbian and gay couples unable to provide security for their partners in the absence of federally recognized civil marriage. This is what we march for on Oct. 11 and every day. Every person coming to Washington—whether they are religious or not—does share one faith, and that is faith in America. We can and must do better. As the progress of history has shown, Americans will prove themselves able to see beyond religion-based bigotry to the promises of equal treatment for all. Those who use religion-based bigotry to persecute and discriminate against LGBT people are on the wrong side of history, just as they were with slavery, interracial marriage, the treatment of women, and so many other issues.

I remember the first time I met Sean Kennedy's mother, Elke, sitting in her family's living room just months after she had lost her precious son as the result of a senseless and hate-filled act of violence. And I will never forget that momentary look on her face when I explained to her that I once was someone whose attitude had helped perpetuate the societal climate in which her son lived and died. It was a moment in which I realized the depths of the wounds I may have inflicted upon a gay teen contemplating suicide or a perpetrator looking to justify hate violence. It is a moment that commands me to continue to march, to speak out, and help others experience the spiritual blessing that comes from unshackling the chains of religion-based bigotry and prejudice.

Brent Childers is the executive director of Faith in America. After changing his views on homosexuality, he left the Southern Baptist Church and now attends both a local Pentacostal and a nondenominational church in Hickory, N.C.

 

 

There are no clean hands in this quarrel…

I came upon a series of articles on Huffington Post…

I know many consider Huffington Post a very left wing website…with the likes of Brian Mclaren, Shane Claiborne, Tony and Bart Campolo, Jim Wallis etc. posting there.  But they make some very good points about important, divisive issues…and upon further pondering…and research…and surfing the internet…and more pondering…..a series has been birthed. 

There are no clean hands in this Christian / Muslim dialogue. Many Christians cry out against terrorism (and well we should all condemn acts of terrorism) but as my cyber bud annie is fond of saying….pot…meet kettle. That is a bit like the pot calling the kettle black. Atrocities have also been committed by followers of the Hebrew God down through the ages…a fact many Christians ignore in their condemnation of Islam.

Those who have never even leafed through the Quran, proclaim the holy book of Islam a book of hate that promotes…demands…violence against those of other faiths.  They’ve taken to heart short, snappy little excerpts repeated over and over like, “Kill the Infidel” without acknowledging that their own holy book…the Bible…also seems to promote violence, war, sacrifice, genocide and a whole host of other unsavory behaviors. When taken at face value, of course. 

I found a quote in an article on the Grove Report Website written by Theresa McCune.  I love the following…short and snappy excerpt from her post….

If you honestly seek the truth about Islam and Muslims, just pick up and read the books written by Muslims, not the ones written about Muslims.  Get your information from the horse’s mouth, not the other end.

Touche’ Theresa!!!!  And I couldn’t agree more….

Most Christians have at least cursory knowledge of the “basics” of Bible interpretation. 

Something along the lines of

OBSERVATION: What does it say?

INTERPRETATION: What does it mean?

APPLICATION: How does the meaning apply to me?

Or in more detail….

1. WHO: Who are the people? Who did it? Who can do it? Who is it talking about?
2. WHAT: What is it saying? What is it talking about? What is happening? What did they do?
3. WHERE: Where are they going? Where did it happen? Where will it take place?
4. WHEN: When did it happen? When will it happen? When can it happen?
5. HOW: How did it happen? How can it happen? How was something done?
6. WHY: Why did he say that? Why did he do that? Why did they go there?

But how many Christians realize there are also principles of Quranic hermeneutics?  Type the phrase into google and 196,000 websites come up in the results. Something to ponder before dismissing the Quran as a holy book of hate. Perhaps the texts, taken out of context and at face value, are the problem….and are not what the message of the Quran is over all. 

This series will meander along…as most of my series do…morphing as I explore and ponder.  I invite you to expand your horizons right along with me…as I expand mine.